# Śrīmad-Bhāgavatam 5.5.2

*Type: Srimad-Bhagavatam Dated: April 13th 1975 Location: Hyderabad Audio file: 750413SB.HYD.mp3*

Prabhupāda:

> ...mahat-sevāṁ dvāram āhur vimuktes
> tamo-dvāraṁ yoṣitāṁ saṅgi-saṅgam

SB 5.5.2

For two days we have explained *mahat-sevāṁ dvāram āhur vimukteḥ.* People have forgotten at the present moment what is the meaning of *mukti.* They do not know practically. *Mukti* means the..., to get out of the clutches of the stringent material laws. That is called *mukti.* We are at the present moment conditioned, so many conditions. So *mukti* means to live without condition. That is called *mukti.* The *mukti* definition is given in the *Śrīmad-Bhāgavatam = muktir sva-rūpeṇa vyavasthitiḥ. Muktir hitvānyathā rūpaṁ sva-rūpeṇa vyavasthitiḥ* SB 2.10.6. This is called *mukti.* We are not in the *svarūpa. Svarūpa* means spiritual form. That is called *svarūpa.* At the present moment, our material conditional body, that is not *svarūpa.* Last night I tried to explain, *svarūpa* means *sac-cit-ānanda-rūpa.* That is *svarūpa*---eternal, blissful life of knowledge. This is not *svarūpa.* This body is not eternal, neither it is blissful. It is full of miseries and without any knowledge. So this is not *svarūpa. Svarūpa* means eternal life, blissful life, and full of knowledge. That is called *svarūpa.*

So we do not know that we are now living conditional life, *virupa,* which is not my *svarūpa.* This is the science that *svarūpa* can be perceived, can be realized. That is described in the *Śrīmad Bhagavad-gītā = brahma-bhūta. Brahma-bhūta,* spiritual realization, that is also not *svarūpa.* That is the beginning of self-realization.

> brahma-bhūtaḥ prasannātmā
> na śocati na kāṅkṣati
> samaḥ sarveṣu bhūteṣu
> mad-bhaktiṁ labhate parām

Bg. 18.54

That is *svarūpa.* After Brahman realization, when one is perfectly free from all material anxieties, that is beginning of *svarūpa.* And then the conception of equality, *samaḥ sarveṣu bhūteṣu, paṇḍitāḥ sama-darśinaḥ* Bg. 5.18. Those who are learned, they have no such distinction that "I am Indian," "You are American," "You are Bengali," "I am Andhra," and this... No. This is all *virūpa.* All *virūpa. Sarvopādhi-vinirmuktam* Cc. Madhya 19.170, we have several times explained. We have to be free from all these designation. That is *svarūpa,* designationless.

But we are now busy with designation and fighting. That means we are not yet completely educated. Kṛṣṇa also chastised Arjuna in the beginning, *asatyam anvaśocas tvam prajñā-vādāṁś ca bhāṣase,* "You are talking like a very learned scholar, but you are lamenting only the body, bodily concept of life." *Gatāsūn agatāsūṁś ca nānuśocanti paṇḍitāḥ* Bg. 2.11 = "So far the body is concerned, either it is dead or alive, a learned man does not care for it." That is *svarūpa.* Now we are simply concerned with this body; therefore we are missing our *svarūpa,* therefore missing *mukti.* I have already explained, *mukti* means to be situated in his own original, spiritual life. That is called *svarūpa. Svarūpanu bhuti*[?]. *Svarūpa.* There is..., I think there is the word used in *Bhagavad-gītā* that all the persons assembled in the Battlefield of Kurukṣetra, after death they attained *svarūpa.* Means liberated, all liberated and situated in spiritual life, because they gave up their life in the presence of Kṛṣṇa. While dying they saw Kṛṣṇa, therefore all of them after death attained *svarūpa.* So the *mukti* means *sva-rūpena vyavasthitiḥ. Mukti hitva anyathā rūpam sva-rūpena vyavasthitiḥ.* This is the meaning of *mukti.* So if we want that *mukti,* liberation, no more conditioned by the material nature, unconditional life, *sa-guṇān samatītyaitān brahma-bhūyāya kalpate* Bg. 14.26. That is *svarūpa.*

So *virūpa* means under the control of the three modes of material nature, *sattva-guṇa, raja-guṇa, tamo-guṇa.* Of course, in the material world the quality of *brāhmaṇa---satya, śama, dama, titikṣa, ārjava, jñānaṁ vijñānam āstikyaṁ brahma-karma svabhāva-jam* Bg. 18.42---this is the first-class quality within this material world. But that is also not *svarūpa.* That is also not *svarūpa.* One may become the topmost person within human society by acquiring brahminical qualification, but that is also not *svarūpa.* Real *svarūpa* is above that brahminical qualification. That is Vaiṣṇava, Vaiṣṇava qualification. Vaiṣṇava qualification means completely dedicated to the service of Kṛṣṇa. *Sarvopādhi vinirmuktam* Cc. Madhya 19.170. Even if I consider myself that I am a learned *brāhmaṇa,* that is also misconception. That is also not *svarūpa.* When one understands that "I am not *brāhmaṇa,* not *kṣatriya,* not *vaiśya,* not *śūdra,* nor American, nor Indian, nor this, nor that; simply I am spiritual part and parcel of Kṛṣṇa, and my only business is to serve Kṛṣṇa," *ānukūlyena kṛṣṇānu-śīlanam bhaktir uttamā* Cc. Madhya 19.167, that is first-class life. *Ānukūlyena kṛṣṇānu-śīlanam.* Not *pratikūlyena. Pratikūlyena* means against the will of Kṛṣṇa. That is *pratikūla. Bhakti* means *ānukūla.* Just like Kamsa. He was also Kṛṣṇa conscious. He was always thinking of Kṛṣṇa = "Whether Kṛṣṇa is born? I have to kill Him. Whether this or that..." He was thinking of Kṛṣṇa. But *pratikūlyena,* not *ānukūlyena.* One Kṛṣṇa consciousness is always making plan how to spread Kṛṣṇa consciousness, and another Kṛṣṇa conscious..., how to kill Kṛṣṇa.

So that two... Kṛṣṇa consciousness to kill Kṛṣṇa, that is not *bhakti.* Kṛṣṇa consciousness how to serve Kṛṣṇa, how to spread Kṛṣṇa's glories all over the world, how to make the people Kṛṣṇa conscious, this Kṛṣṇa consciousness is *ānukūla. Ānukūlyena kṛṣṇa...,* cultivation of Kṛṣṇa knowledge, that is required. And when one is fully situated in that Kṛṣṇa consciousness, that is called *mukti. Mukti* does not mean "Now I've got two hands; I will have four hands," like that. No. *Mukti* means change of consciousness. At this time, the present moment, every one of us, we are thinking that "I am this body. This family is my kinsmen," *yasyātma buddhiḥ kunape tri-dhātuke svā-dhīḥ kalatrādiṣu bhauma-ijya-dhīḥ* SB 10.84.13. "This is my country. I have to worship it. I have to develop." All these consciousness is just the opposite number of Kṛṣṇa consciousness, when we shall always think of Kṛṣṇa, *satataṁ cintayanto mām:* always thinking of Kṛṣṇa, how to spread Kṛṣṇa's glories, how it is possible to adopt the means and ways and plans and always thinking, just like Śrī Caitanya Mahāprabhu did and all the *ācāryas,* the Gosvāmīs. We have to follow *mahājano yena gataḥ sa panthāḥ* Cc. Madhya 17.186.

That *mahājana yena gataḥ sa panthāḥ* is situat..., explained here, *mahat-sevā. Mahat-sevā. Mahājana...,* to follow the *mahājana* means to serve their mission.

> śrī-caitanya-mano 'bhīṣṭaṁ
> sthāpitaṁ yena bhū-tale
> svayaṁ rūpaḥ kadā mahyaṁ
> dadāti sva-padāntikam

We Gauḍīya Vaiṣṇava, we are known as *rūpānuga. Rūpānuga* means the followers of Rūpa Gosvāmī. So why we should become followers of Rūpa Gosvāmī? Because *śrī-caitanya-mano 'bhīṣṭaṁ sthāpitaṁ yena bhū-tale:* he wanted to establish the mission of Śrī Caitanya Mahāprabhu. *Mano 'bhīṣṭam. Śrī-caitanya-mano 'bhīṣṭam,* Śrī Caitanya Mahāprabhu, the same thing. This is called disciplic succession. Kṛṣṇa wanted that "Everyone be surrendered to Me." He personally therefore comes, and He speaks *Bhagavad-gītā* aiming at Arjuna, who was perplexed in the Battlefield of Kurukṣetra, and He explained *karma, jñāna, yoga, dhyāna,* so many things. But ultimately, He assured Arjuna, "My dear Arjuna, you are very dear friend to Me; therefore I am speaking to you the real purpose of life, *sarva-dharmān parityajya mām ekaṁ śaraṇaṁ...* Bg. 18.66. This is the real purpose of life." So Kṛṣṇa wanted that people should take shelter of His lotus feet, *sarva-dharmān parityajya.* But people misunderstood Him. Therefore Kṛṣṇa came as a devotee, Śrī Caitanya Mahāprabhu. Rūpa Gosvāmī could understand that; therefore he offered his first prayer to Śrī Caitanya Mahāprabhu, *namo mahā vadānyāya kṛṣṇa-prema-pradāya te* Cc. Madhya 19.53. "Śrī Caitanya Mahāprabhu, You are the most munificent incarnation because You are not only giving the knowledge of Kṛṣṇa, but You are giving the process how to love Him," *kṛṣṇa-prema-pradāya te.* So "You are Kṛṣṇa, *kṛṣṇaya.* I offer my humble obeisances to You, *kṛṣṇaya,* now appeared as *kṛṣṇa-caitanya-namine.* You have now appeared as Kṛṣṇa Caitanya."

So Kṛṣṇa personally appeared as devotee to reestablish the mission of Kṛṣṇa. Kṛṣṇa wanted *sarva-dharmān parityajya* Bg. 18.66, and Caitanya Mahāprabhu preached Kṛṣṇa consciousness, *kṛṣṇa-varṇaṁ tviṣa akṛṣṇa.* This is a statement in the *Śrīmad-Bhāgavatam*---the real identification of Śrī Caitanya Mahāprabhu. That is... In this age there was talk between Nimi Mahārāja and Navayogendra. So what is the duty of the people of Kali-yuga to worship the Supreme? In that connection, Karabhājana Muni, he said,

> kṛṣṇa-varṇaṁ tviṣākṛṣṇaṁ
> sāṅgopāṅgāstra-pārṣadam
> yajñaiḥ saṅkīrtana-prāyair
> yajanti hi su-medhasaḥ

SB 11.5.32

This is the method of worship. What is that? That Supreme Personality of Godhead who is always chanting Hare Kṛṣṇa *mantra. Kṛṣṇa varṇayati, kṛṣṇa varṇa tvīṣa akṛṣṇam.* But His bodily complexion is not *kṛṣṇa,* not blackish, but yellowish, *tvīṣa. Tvīṣa* means by the complexion *akṛṣṇa,* not Kṛṣṇa. And another symptom, *sāṅgopāṅgāstra-pārṣadam.* He's associated with His most confidential devotees and expansion. Therefore we chant,

> śrī-kṛṣṇa-caitanya prabhu nityānanda
> śrī-advaita gadādhara śrīvāsādi-gaura-bhakta-vṛnda

This is *sāṅgopāṅgāstra-pārṣadam.* This form of the Lord, *yajñaiḥ saṅkīrtanaiḥ,* He's worshiped not by ritualistic ceremony, which is very expensive, or performance of *yajña.* That is not possible in this age because there is no yajñic *brāhmaṇa* at the present moment.

So this Vaidic *yajña* is permitted in the..., prohibited in this Kali-yuga because they are not properly performed. It is not possible. Just like our Śrīman Pittieji was searching after a *brāhmaṇa* to recite the *Rāmāyaṇa, Sundara-kanda.* He's not getting a proper *brāhmaṇa.* That is the difficulty. How you can perform *yajña?* There is no yajñic *brāhmaṇa* at the present moment. Therefore the *yajña* to be performed at this moment in this Kali-yuga is *yajñaiḥ saṅkīrtana-prāyaiḥ yajanti hi su-medhasaḥ. Su-medhasaḥ* means with good brain substance. Those who have no brain substance, they are called *alpa-medhasaḥ.* That is also stated in the *Bhagavad-gītā, tad bhavati alpa-medhasaḥ. Alpa-medhasaḥ* means there is no brain substance---filled up with cow dung. So one should be *su-medhasaḥ. Su-medhasaḥ,* nice brain substance. So those who are *su-medhasaḥ* means with good brain substance, they perform *yajñair saṅkīrtanair* by *saṅkīrtana yajña,* Hare Kṛṣṇa. Just see the effect of Hare Kṛṣṇa *mantra.* This *yajña* being performed all over the world, how quickly they are capturing Kṛṣṇa consciousness. Just see the effect practically. Therefore those who are intelligent, having good brain substance, they should perform *yajña saṅkīrtana, yajñaiḥ saṅ...,* and worship Lord Caitanya.

> śrī-kṛṣṇa-caitanya prabhu nityānanda
> śrī-advaita gadādhara śrīvāsādi-gaura-bhakta-vṛnda

So these ideas can be had only if we follow the *mahājana. Mahājana* means that Śrīla Rūpa Gosvāmī, he understood Śrī Caitanya Mahāprabhu. About Rūpa Gosvāmī it is said... What is that? *Vande rūpa-sanātanau raghu-yugau śrī-jīva-gopālakau. Kīrtana...* Uh?

Devotees: *Kṛṣṇotkīrtana.*

Prabhupāda:

> kṛṣṇotkīrtana-gāna-nartana-parau premāmṛtāmbho-nidhī
> dhīrādhīra-jana-priyau priya-karau nirmatsarau pūjitau
> śrī-caitanya-kṛpā-bharau bhuvi bhuvo bhārāvahantārakau
> vande rūpa-sanātanau raghu-yugau śrī-jīva-gopālakau

This is the... The six Gosvāmīs of Vṛndāvana, they lived in Vṛndāvana by the order... The present Vṛndāvana, holy place, was made by Rūpa Gosvāmī and Sanātana Gosvāmī. These two brothers, they were ministers in the government of Nawab Hussain Shah. Practically they became Muhammadans; their name were changed. Because in those days the *brāhmaṇa* community was very strict. Any *brāhmaṇa* accepting service, he'll be immediately excommunicated = "No, you are not *brāhmaṇa.*" *Brāhmaṇa's* business is not to serve others. *Brahma-karma svabhāva-jam.* They should remain... Everyone was independent. *Brāhmaṇa* independent, *kṣatriya* independent, *vaiśya* independent. Simply *śūdras* dependent. So in those days, five hundred years ago, these two brothers were born of a very high class *brāhmaṇa.* They were learned scholar. But because they accepted the service of Nawab, they were excommunicated. So practically they become Muhammadans. Their names were changed = Dabira Khāsa, Sākara Mallika. But Śrī Caitanya Mahāprabhu made them *gosvāmīs.* This is Śrī Caitanya Mahāprabhu. They were rejected by the *brāhmaṇa* community, and Śrī Caitanya Mahāprabhu made them Sanātana Gosvāmī, Rūpa Gosvāmī. The *gosvāmī* is not a caste title. *Gosvāmī* means who has control over the senses. *Go* means senses, and *svāmī* means master. Those who are servant of the senses, they cannot become *gosvāmī.* That is not *gosvāmī.* Servant of senses, that is *go-dāsa,* not *gosvāmī.* So the Gosvāmī... *Vande rūpa-sanātanau raghu-yugau,* the six Gosvāmīs, six Gosvāmīs, and if we follow their footprints, *rūpānuga-varāya te,* then he also becomes *gosvāmī.* This is the process. Therefore in any way you go, it is required, *mahat-sevā. Mahat-sevā.* The Gosvāmīs are *mahat.*

> bahūnāṁ janmanām ante
> jñānavān māṁ prapadyate
> vāsudevaḥ sarvam iti
> sa mahātmā sudurlabhaḥ

Bg. 7.19

This is *mahātmā,* one who has fully surrendered to the lotus feet of Kṛṣṇa after mature experience and wisdom, *bahūnāṁ janmanām ante.* Many, many births we may go on philosophizing Brahman, *neti, neti.* But after many, many births, this is *jñānavān.* The *jñānis,* they are after Brahman realization. So Kṛṣṇa says, *bahūnāṁ janmanām ante jñānavān māṁ prapadyate* Bg. 7.19 = "After many, many births of this Brahman realization or Paramātmā realization, one may come to the platform of realizing the Supreme Personality of Godhead." Who is that Supreme Per...? Vāsudeva, the son of Vasudeva, Kṛṣṇa. Vāsudeva. *Oṁ namo bhagavate vāsudevāya. Vāsudevaḥ sarvam iti sa mahātmā su-durlabhaḥ* Bg. 7.19. That is *mahātmā.* One who knows *vāsudeva sarvam iti,* that *mahātmā* is required. And if we can serve such *mahātmā,* then our path of liberation, *mukti,* will be open. That is stated here = *mahat-sevāṁ dvāram āhur vimukteḥ.*

And the other way? One path to *mukti;* another path is bondage. Two things are there = bondage and *mukti. Andhā yathāndhair upanīyamānās te'pīśa-tantryām uru-dāmni baddhāḥ* SB 7.5.31. *Baddhā* means bound up. We are, in our material condition of life, we are bound up tight, hands and legs are bound up. We cannot do anything independently. It is not possible. That we must know. People are declaring independence. That is not possible. That is our foolishness. *Baddhāḥ, uru-dāmni baddhāḥ.* Just like *uru* means this waist. If you are bound up by rope just like thieves are carried, handcuffed and bound up on the waist, what you can do? So we are *uru-dāmni baddhāḥ. Uru* means very strong, and *dāmni* means rope; *baddhāḥ.* Just like the bulls are, I mean to say, bound up in the nostril and the driver is moving like this, immediately he has to move this way, immediately. Although he's very strong bull, but *uru-dāmni baddhāḥ.*

So therefore *māyā's* name is *guṇamayī. Guṇa, guṇa* means also rope, *guṇa. Guṇamayī, tri-guṇa-mayī,* three ropes you bound together become very strong. Similarly, this *māyā,* the stringent laws of material nature, *prakṛti,* is very, very strong. You cannot declare independence. That is not possible. If you really want independence, then you *mahat-sevāṁ dvāram āhur vimuktes.* Then you have to take shelter of *mahājana, mahat-sevā.* That is the instruction of *Bhagavad-gītā,* that *tad viddhi praṇipātena* Bg. 4.34. First thing is that this... *Mukti* means you have to become surrendered either to Kṛṣṇa or Kṛṣṇa's representative. Otherwise there is no question of *mukti.* And if you do not do this, if you think that "Eat, drink, be merry and enjoy life," that is called *yoṣi saṅga, yoṣitāṁ saṅgi-saṅgam.* What is that? *Tamo-dvāram.* That means you are making progress towards darkness, *tamo-dvāram,* hellish condition of life.

> na te viduḥ svārtha-gatiṁ hi viṣṇuṁ
> durāśayā ye bahir-artha māninaḥ

SB 7.5.31

> matir na kṛṣṇe parataḥ svato vā
> mitho 'bhipadyeta gṛha-vratānām
> adānta-gobhir viśatāṁ tamisraṁ
> punaḥ punaś carvita-carvaṇānām

SB 7.5.30

These are the instructions Prahlāda Mahārāja gave. He wanted to teach his father, atheist father. So his father inquired, "Prahlāda, how you have developed this Kṛṣṇa consciousness?" So Prahlāda began to smile and said to his father, *matir na kṛṣṇe parataḥ svato vā.* He did not address his father "my dear father." He used to address him as "the best of the *asuras,*" *asura-varya. Tat sādhu manye 'sura-varya.* So he said, "My dear father," *matir na kṛṣṇe parataḥ svato vā,* "to become Kṛṣṇa conscious is not so easy." *Parataḥ svato vā.* "Even if you hear instruction from others or if you speculate yourself, it is not possible." *Matir na kṛṣṇe parataḥ svato vā mitho 'bhi,* "or making by assembly, conference." Why? *Na gṛha-vratānām:* "If you have this intention, that 'I shall live in this material world. I shall become happy in this material world,' then there is no question of becoming advanced in Kṛṣṇa consciousness." *Matir na kṛṣṇe parataḥ svato vā mitho 'bhipadyeta gṛha-vratānām.*

Why they are so much attached? *Adānta-gobhiḥ,* because they are not *gosvāmīs. Adānta. Adānta* means uncontrolled; *go* means senses. They have given freedom to the senses = "Whatever you like, you do." So the result is exactly that you let loose your horses---"Whatever you like, you can do"---then it will go and cause you to fall down in a ditch, *adānta-gobhiḥ;* similarly, if we give freedom to the senses, *adānta-gobhir viśatāṁ tamisram,* we go to the darkest region of hellish condition of life. And what is that? *Punaḥ punaś carvita-carvaṇānām* SB 7.5.30, again and again the same disease = birth, death, old age and disease. *Punaḥ punaś carvita-carvaṇānām,* this life or that life, the birth, death, old age, disease will continue.

So if you have got determination that "We shall continue this life of birth, death, old age and disease and let loose our senses, do whatever you like," then there is no question of liberation. There is no lib... Therefore it is said, *tamo-dvāram yoṣitaṁ saṅgi-saṅgam. Yoṣitaṁ saṅgi-saṅgam* means..., *yoṣit* means woman, generally. The woman is supposed to be the representative of *māyā.* So either you directly keep relation or you keep relation with persons who are very much fond of *yoṣit,* in both ways you have to go directly to the darkest region of hellish condition, *tamo-dvāram.* Therefore our Vedic civilization is... The first teaching is *brahmacārī.* First teaching, how to become *brahmacārī.* There are many saintly persons, they are *akhaṇḍa brahmacārī* or *āvala*[?] *brahmacārī.* They avoid. It is not only for men; it is meant for woman also, because here we are dressed like men and women. Otherwise the mentality is manly, to enjoy, *puruṣa. Puruṣa* means who wants to enjoy, and *yoṣit* means enjoy. So our relationship in this material world, that either in the dress of woman or man, the mentality is *puruṣa,* how to enjoy. Mentality is *puruṣa.*

So when we give up this mentality, enjoyer... Because we are not actually enjoyer. Enjoyer is Kṛṣṇa. Kṛṣṇa says,

> bhoktāraṁ yajña-tapasāṁ
> sarva-loka-maheśvaram
> suhṛdaṁ sarva-bhūtānāṁ
> jñātvā māṁ...

Bg. 5.29

And in the *Bhagava...* Arjuna also addresses Kṛṣṇa, *paraṁ brahma paraṁ dhāma pavitraṁ paramaṁ bhavān, puruṣaṁ śāśvatam* [Bg. 10.12] = "You are the only *puruṣa, śāśvata.*" So we are simply thinking of becoming *puruṣa,* enjoyer. But we are not *puruṣa.* We are all *prakṛti.* It is described in the *Bhagavad-gītā,* the *jīva-bhūta = apareyam itas tu viddhi me prakṛtiṁ parām* Bg. 7.5. *Prakṛti,* another *prakṛti* is there. "This material *prakṛti,*" *bhūmir āpo 'nalo vāyuḥ* Bg. 7.4, "they are My *bhinnā prakṛti,*" *bhinnā prakṛtir me aṣṭadhā.* "But besides that, there is another *prakṛti.*" *Prakṛti* means... Who is that *prakṛti? Jīva-bhūta,* the living entities. The living entity's *prakṛti.* He is not *puruṣa.* Constitutionally, *prakṛti* means the things which are enjoyed. That is called *prakṛti.* And the enjoyer is called *puruṣa.* So nobody of us, either men or women, we are not *puruṣa.* We are all *prakṛti* constitutionally. That is called *hitvānyathā rūpaṁ sva-rūpeṇa vyavasthitiḥ.* When you live as *prakṛti,* not as *puruṣa,* that is called *mukti.* This is the definition of *mukti. Mahat-sevāṁ dvāram āhur vimukteḥ* SB 5.5.2. Every one of us, we are thinking as *puruṣa,* enjoyer. That is the fight between..., going on. Just like in Western countries, the *prakṛtis,* the woman, they're also fighting = "We have equal rights with the man." So this is going on.

So this is all conditional life, the so-called *puruṣa* life, or so-called *prakṛti* life. Unless we have got real enlightenment what is our real, constitutional position, that we can learn only by the association of *mahat, mahat-sevāṁ dvāram āhur vimukteḥ.* That is the Vedic process, *tad-vijñānārthaṁ sa gurum evābhigacchet* [*MU* 1.2.12]. We must take shelter. Kṛṣṇa also says that,

> tad viddhi praṇipātena
> paripraśnena sevayā
> upadekṣyanti tad jñānaṁ
> jñāninas tattva-darśinaḥ

Bg. 4.34

Everywhere, in *Śrīmad-Bhāgavatam* also the same thing is explained, *tasmād guruṁ prapadyeta jijñāsur śreya uttamam* SB 11.3.21. If you are inquisitive to understand transcendental truth, the Absolute Truth, the *guru* is... To have a *guru* is not a fashion. Now it has become a fashion. If somebody shows some jugglery, people become very much anxious to accept such *guru.* No. *Guru* means *tasmād guruṁ prapadyeta.* Who requires a *guru? Jijñāsu śreya uttamam.* One who is very much anxious to know about the ultimate benefit of life, for him *guru* is required. Not a fashion. Just like we keep a dog as a fashion. Nowadays it is a fashion to keep a dog. So don't keep a *guru* like a dog. And who will hear you, "Come on. Come on." "Yes." Not like that. *Guru* require, then, where you can surrender. Not like a dog, but master, where you can surrender. *Tasmād guruṁ prapadyeta. Prapadyeta* means you must surrender.

And why you should surrender? *Jijñāsu:* if you are actually inquisitive, inquirer. What about? *Śreya uttamam. Śreya* means the ultimate benefit of life, and *preya* means immediate benefit of life. There are two things = *śreya* and *preya.* The human life is meant for *sreya,* and animal life is meant for *preya,* immediate benefit. That is called *preya.* And *śreya* means ultimate benefit of life. That one who is inquisitive to understand about the ultimate goal of life, for him there is need of *guru,* not a fashion. *Tasmād guruṁ prapadyeta jijñāsur śreya uttamam* SB 11.3.21. Then what is that *guru?* That is also explained = *śābde pare ca niṣṇātaṁ brahmaṇy upaśamāśrayam. Śābde* means Vedic literature. Vedic... He has drowned himself, he has bathed himself in the ocean of *Vedas. Śābde pare ca niṣṇātam.* Just like if you take bathing in a river, deep down you'll become refreshed. Similarly, one has to take *śābde pare ca niṣṇātam.* And what is the symptom how I shall know that he has taken bathing fully in the ocean of *Veda? Brahmaṇy upaśamāśrayam:* he has finished all desires for material happiness or distress. He is *brāhmaṇy upaśamāśrayam.* He has taken shelter of Brahman---the same thing, Para-brahman, Kṛṣṇa. *Sarva-dharmān parityajya mām ekaṁ śaraṇaṁ vraja* Bg. 18.66. One who has taken fully shelter under the lotus feet of Para-brahman, Kṛṣṇa, you have to take shelter of such a *guru.* Otherwise you'll not be able to get out of these clutches of *māyā. Tasmād guruṁ prapadyeta* SB 11.3.21, every *śāstra* you go.

So therefore here it is said that if you are actually anxious to become free from this material condition of life, then you must accept the service of *mahat-sevā. Mahat* means one who has fully surrendered to Kṛṣṇa. He's *mahat. Vāsudeva sarvam iti.* One who has taken this conclusion, *vāsudeva sarvam iti, sa mahātmā su-durlabhaḥ* Bg. 7.19. *Mahātmānas tu māṁ pārtha daivīṁ prakṛtim āśritāḥ, bhajanty ananya-manaso* Bg. 9.13. These are the formulas. So *mahātmā* means the fully surrendered soul unto the lotus feet of Kṛṣṇa. He is the first-class *mahātmā. Sa mahātmā su-durlabhaḥ.* Not ordinary *mahātmā,* but *su-durlabhaḥ.* And what are the signs? *Mahātmānas tu māṁ pārtha daivīṁ prakṛtim, bhajanty ananya-manaso.* He has no other business except worshiping Kṛṣṇa, that's all. *Mām ekam.* In this way, if we find the opportunity, then there is possibility of *mukti. Mahat-sevāṁ dvāram āhur vimukteḥ.* And if we associate with the *yoṣi saṅgi,* those who are desirous of enjoying this material world under different pleas, you..., if you associate with them, then you glide down to the darkest region of hellish condition of life.

In the next verses it is said, *mahāntas te sama-cittāḥ.* Then what is the symptoms of *mahātmā?* So He says, I mean to say, Ṛṣabhādeva says, *sama-cittāḥ:* equilibrium, not disturbed by material condition. *Sama-cittāḥ, sama sarveṣu bhūteṣu.* The same thing. *Sama-cittāḥ praśāntā:* peaceful. *Praśāntā. Pra* means *prakṛsta rūpena,* fully peaceful. And when one can become fully *praśāntā,* fully peaceful? When he has no more desire. *Anyābhilāṣitā-śūnyam* [Brs. 1.1.11], no more desire. *Brahma-bhūtaḥ prasannātmā* Bg. 18.54. Everything is described. So *praśāntātmā.* It is described in the *Caitanya-caritāmṛta,* so long you will want something, there is no question of *praśāntātmā.* So therefore *Caitanya-caritāmṛta-kar* says, *bhukti mukti siddhi kāmi-sakali aśānta. Bhukti* means *karmīs. Karmīs* means those who are working very hard to get some material benefit. They are called *karmī.* Either in this world or the next world or heavenly planet, there are different types of *karmīs.* So the *bhukti... Bhukti* means *bhoga,* sense enjoyment. They are called *karmīs.* So *bhukti* or *mukti. Mukti* means liberation, to get out of this material contamination. That is called *mukti, sva-rūpena vyavasthitiḥ* SB 2.10.6. But just like the *jñānīs,* they want *mukti, sāyujya mukti,* to become one with the Supreme. So *mukti..., bhukti, mukti* and *siddhi. Siddhi* means yogic perfection = *aṇimā, laghimā, prāpti,* eight kinds of *yoga-siddhi.* So the *yogīs,* the *jñānīs* and the *karmīs,* they want something. They want something. Therefore they are not *praśāntā.* As soon as..., so long you'll want, you..., there cannot be peacefulness. There is no..., no question of peacefulness. *Caitanya-caritam... Bhukti mukti siddhi kāmi-sakali aśānta,* they are not *praśāntā. Kṛṣṇa-bhakta-niṣkāma, ataeva 'śānta'* Cc. Madhya 19.149. *Kṛṣṇa bhakta,* he does not want anything. Caitanya Mahāprabhu is teaching that,

> na dhanaṁ na janaṁ na sundarīṁ
> kavitāṁ vā jagad-īśa kāmaye
> mama janmani janmanīśvare
> bhavatād bhaktir ahaitukī tvayi

Cc. Antya 20.29, Śikṣāṣṭaka 4]

This is called *śānti:* "I don't want anything." *Na dhanaṁ na janaṁ na sundarīṁ kavitāṁ vā jagad-īśa kāmaye.* This is *bhukti. Karmīs,* they want. They want many followers, many voters, so that "I can become minister or president." So Caitanya Mahāprabhu says, "No, I don't want many voters." *Na janaṁ. Na sundarīm kavitām,* "Neither very beautiful wife." These are material demands, to get money or wealth, sumptuously; to get a good wife and many followers, many workers. Caitanya Mahāprabhu denies, *na dhanaṁ na janaṁ na sundarīṁ kavitāṁ vā jagad-īśa kāmaye.* "Then what do You want?" *Mama janmani janmanīśvare.* He doesn't want *mukti* even. Otherwise, how He says *janmani, janmani? Mukti* means no more *janma.* But Caitanya Mahāprabhu says, *mama janmani janmani.* It doesn't matter. *Mama janmani janmanīśvare bhavatād ahaitukī bhakti.* That's all.

Therefore if you want to become *praśāntā,* fully satisfied... Just like Dhruva Mahārāja, he went to the forest and underwent severe *tapasya* to see the Supreme Personality of Godhead. But when he actually saw Him, he said, *svamin kṛtārtho 'smi varaṁ na yāce* Cc. Madhya 22.42 = "I don't want any benediction." This is *praśāntā,* no one disturbing Kṛṣṇa for any personal, material benefits. That is called *praśāntā.* That is stated here, *mahānta.* This is *mahānta, sama-cittāḥ praśāntā vimanyavaḥ. Vimanyavaḥ.* Because a devotee has to suffer so many tribulation. That is the history of all devotees. But he's never angry. He's never angry. Then he falls down. *Vimanyavaḥ.* Just like Lord Jesus Christ. He was being crucified; he still, he was praying, "God, these people, they do not know what they are doing." *Vimanyavaḥ,* never angry. If he becomes angry, then who he'll preach? He is criticized... [break]

There is a description of *sādhavaḥ* in Kapiladeva's instruction that *titikṣavaḥ kāruṇikāḥ* SB 3.25.21. *Sādhu* means very tolerant. That is taught by Śrī Caitanya Mahāprabhu = *tṛṇād api sunīcena taror api sahiṣṇunā.* So the first qualification of *sādhu* is *titikṣavaḥ,* and at the same time *kāruṇikāḥ.* There are many instances. Just like Prahlāda Mahārāja = he tolerated so many tortures even by his father. *Titikṣavaḥ.* And at the same time he was thinking, "How to deliver these persons who are not Kṛṣṇa conscious?" That is *kāruṇikāḥ.* He is personally being tortured, but at the same time he was thinking how to do good to others. This is *sādhu. Titikṣavaḥ kāruṇikāḥ. Suhṛdaṁ sarva-bhūtānām* Bg. 5.29 = he's friend, not only to the human society, but he's friend to the ant even. A devotee does not like that even an ant should be killed. No. *Suhṛdaṁ sarva-bhūtānāṁ, titikṣavaḥ kāruṇikāḥ suhṛdaḥ sarva..., ajāta-śatravaḥ.* He does not create any enemy, but unfortunately the demons becomes his enemy. What can be done? *Suhṛdam sarva-bhūtānām, ajāta-śatravaḥ śāntāḥ.* Again this same word, *praśāntā,* "fully satisfied." He has nothing to hanker after, because he has got Kṛṣṇa. Why he should hanker? *Śāntā, praśāntā.*

> titikṣavaḥ kāruṇikāḥ
> suhṛdaḥ sarva-bhūtānām
> ajāta-śatravaḥ śāntāḥ
> sādhavaḥ sādhu-bhūṣaṇaḥ

SB 3.25.21

This is the *sādhu.* Therefore Kṛṣṇa says in the *Bhagavad-gītā, api cet sudurācāro bhajate mām ananya-bhāk, sādhur eva sa mantavyaḥ* Bg. 9.30. He is *sādhu.* No more *sādhu.* This is *sādhu.* Therefore, here it is same thing, *vimanyavaḥ suhṛdaḥ sādhavo ye.* So we have to approach *sādhu.* We have to approach devotee. We have to approach *praśāntā.* And if we become fortunate to serve him, then the liberation, the path of liberation, is open.

Thank you very much.

Devotees: *Jaya* Prabhupāda. All glories to Śrīla Prabhupāda. [break]

Prabhupāda: Any question? [background discussion about microphone] Who is the in-charge of microphone? Go on. [feedback noise] What happened?

Acyutānanda: [reading question] "In the *Vedas* the *mahā-mantra* is repeated Hare Rāma, Hare Rāma, Rāma Rāma, Hare Hare/ Hare Kṛṣṇa, Hare Kṛṣṇa, Kṛṣṇa Kṛṣṇa, Hare Hare. What is the significance of changing the order?"

Prabhupāda: There is no change of order. If you like, you can begin with Hare Rāma. There is no harm.

Acyutānanda: [to audience] We request everyone to please print very clearly and make your questions brief, to save time. [reading question] "Many people say that Lord Kṛṣṇa is the King of romance. What is the truth?"

Prabhupāda: King of...?

Devotees: Romance.

Prabhupāda: Romance?

Tamāla Kṛṣṇa: Romantic. King of lovers.

Prabhupāda: Yes. Kṛṣṇa means the supreme lover and beloved. He attracts everyone. There is one Greek word, *krista.* The meaning is the same, "love." And from this *krista* the word *Christ* has come. So this word *Christ* also has connection with Kṛṣṇa.

Acyutānanda: "How to see Lord Kṛṣṇa? Can anybody see Him by chanting the holy name Hare Kṛṣṇa *mantra?* Is it possible for a human being in his short period of life?"

Prabhupāda: Yes. If he develops love for Kṛṣṇa. That I have explained the other day, *premāñjana-cchurita-bhakti-vilocanena santaḥ sadaiva hṛdayeṣu vilokayanti* [Bs. 5.38]. If you develop love for Kṛṣṇa, *premā, premā pum-artho mahān,* that is the recommendation by Śrī Caitanya Mahāprabhu, that *dharma, artha, kāma, mokṣa* Cc. Ādi 1.90 is not the aim of life. *Premā pum-artho mahān.* After liberation...

> brahma-bhūtaḥ prasannātmā
> na śocati na kāṅkṣati
> samaḥ sarveṣu
> mad-bhaktiṁ labhate parām

Bg. 18.54

When one is engaged in devotional service, loving devotional service, then he can increase his love for Kṛṣṇa. The love for Kṛṣṇa is there. In the *Caitanya-caritāmṛta* it is said, *kṛṣṇa...,*

> nitya-siddha kṛṣṇa-prema 'sādhya' kabhu naya
> śravaṇādi-śuddha-citte karaye udaya

Cc. Madhya 22.107

The love for Kṛṣṇa is there, everywhere. Just like these European, American boys. Why they are loving Kṛṣṇa? It is not foreign. It was there. It was there. Similarly, in everyone's heart there is love for Kṛṣṇa. By cultivation ,that Kṛṣṇa consciousness, that love becomes developed. And when you develop that love for Kṛṣṇa, then you will see Kṛṣṇa twenty-four hours. That is wanted. So *ādau śraddhā tataḥ sādhu saṅga tato 'nartha-nivṛttiḥ syāt tato niṣṭhā tato bhakti... Tato niṣṭhā tathāśaktis tato bhava sādhakānām ayām premṇaḥ prādurbhāve bhavet kramaḥ* Cc. Madhya 23.14-15. This is the *ādau śraddhā.* Just like you have come here in this Kṛṣṇa consciousness movement meeting because you have got little *śraddhā,* faith. This is called *śraddhā.* You have to increase this *śraddhā.* How? *Ādau śraddhā tataḥ sādhu saṅga* Cc. Madhya 22.83 = those who are Kṛṣṇa devotees, you have to associate with them. You cannot develop Kṛṣṇa consciousness by associating with drunkards and others. No. That is not possible. You have to associate with *kṛṣṇa-bhakta. Ādau śraddhā tataḥ sādhu saṅga* Cc. Madhya 23.14-15. *Sādhu* means *bhajate mām ananya-bhāk, sādhur eva sa mantavyaḥ* Bg. 9.30. I've already described the *sādhu.* If you want love of Kṛṣṇa, then you have to associate with *sādhu. Sādhu* means *kṛṣṇa-bhakta. Ādau śraddhā tataḥ sādhu-saṅgo, tato bhajana-kriyā* Cc. Madhya 23.14-15. Association with *sādhu* means you'll learn, *bhajana-kriyā.*

Just like many people come in our Society not in the beginning as devotee---as a matter of inquisitiveness. Then gradually he wants to become initiated. He approaches, "Kindly initiate me. Make me a disciple." *Bhajana kriyā.* This is called *bhajana-kriyā.* And if you actually perform *bhajana-kriyā,* then *anartha nivṛttiḥ syāt.* All these unwanted things which you have learned, you have become habituated---mainly illicit sex, meat-eating, intoxication and gambling---that becomes finished. *Anartha-nivṛttiḥ syāt.* No more attachment for these things. Then *niṣṭhā,* firm conviction. Then *ruci,* taste. Then *āsaktiḥ,* attachment. Then *bhāva,* "Oh, Kṛṣṇa is so nice." Then *prema.* That requires... If you have developed your love for Kṛṣṇa, then you will see Kṛṣṇa twenty-four hours.

> premāñjana-cchurita-bhakti-vilocanena
> santaḥ sadaiva hṛdayeṣu vilokayanti
> yaṁ śyāmasundaram acintya-guṇa-svarūpaṁ
> govindam ādi-puruṣaṁ tam ahaṁ bhajāmi

[Bs. 5.38]

This is the process. So if by the mercy of Kṛṣṇa you practice this process, then you'll see Kṛṣṇa always. There is no... Kṛṣṇa is not concealed. He is prepared to be revealed. He comes Himself, "See Me. See My feature. Here I am. Here is my *līlā,* Vṛndāvana *līlā.*" But you don't see, don't like to see. That is our defect. Otherwise, Kṛṣṇa is always ready to be revealed. *Premāñjana-cchurita-bhakti-vilocanena santaḥ sadaiva hṛdayeṣu* [Bs. 5.38]. *Sadaiva,* twenty-four hours you'll see.

So Kṛṣṇa is open for everyone. *Māṁ hi pārtha vyapāśritya ye 'pi syuḥ pāpa-yonayaḥ* Bg. 9.32, it doesn't matter you are born in a low-grade family. It doesn't matter. Still, *striyo vaiśyās tathā śūdrās te 'pi yānti parāṁ gatim,* you'll get the highest result of life by seeing Kṛṣṇa, you see. So *kṛṣṇa-bhakti* is *ahaituky apratihatā.* It cannot be checked by any material condition if you are serious about it. Then Kṛṣṇa will help you. *Teṣāṁ satata-yuktānāṁ bhajatāṁ prīti-pūrvakam, dadāmi buddhi-yogaṁ tam* Bg. 10.10 = "I'll give him intelligence how to see Me." These things are there. So if you are serious to see Kṛṣṇa then Kṛṣṇa is ready to be seen by you. It is not very difficult task.

Acyutānanda: "Is there any difference between Śiva and Kṛṣṇa?"

Prabhupāda: Yes. There is no difference, and difference also. Just like milk and yogurt, *dahī. Dahī* is nothing but milk, but still it is not milk. That is the example. That... What is *dahī? Dahī* is transformation of milk. But you cannot say it is milk. Will you accept *dahī* instead of milk? Or will it act the same way? No. So everything is like that. *Acintya-bhedābheda-tattva.* Kṛṣṇa has explained this fact. What is that?

> mayā tatam idaṁ sarvaṁ
> jagad avyakta-mūrtinā
> mat-sthāni sarva-bhūtāni
> nāhaṁ teṣu avasthitaḥ

Bg. 9.4

"Everything is resting in Me." But if you'll see..., if you say, "Then everything is Yourself?" No. *Nāhaṁ teṣu avasthitaḥ,* Kṛṣṇa is everything; at the same time everything is not Kṛṣṇa. This is called *acintya-bhedābheda,* simultaneously one and different. So Lord Śiva is also expansion of Kṛṣṇa. *Ahaṁ bīja-pradaḥ pitā* Bg. 14.4. That form is Lord Śiva. So but, he said that *dadhī vikāra. Dadhī. Dadhī* means yogurt. Milk is transformed into yogurt, *dahī.* And when it is *dahī,* it is no more milk. This is the idea. If you require milk for some purpose and if I give you *dahī,* "That is same thing, sir. Why don't you take?" No. It will be different effect.

Acyutānanda: "Please clarify whether Śrī Caitanya Mahāprabhu was a devotee of Kṛṣṇa or is He Himself *avatāra* of Kṛṣṇa?"

Prabhupāda: If you plug your ears, then how can I explain? So many times we have said that Śrī Caitanya Mahāprabhu is Kṛṣṇa, *kṛṣṇāya kṛṣṇa-caitanya-nāmine gaura-tviṣe namaḥ.* He has appeared in the name of Kṛṣṇa Caitanya, but He's Kṛṣṇa Himself. We have to follow this.

Acyutānanda: "How can the world survive when people forget their *karma* and immerse themselves in Kṛṣṇa consciousness? Won't it lead to inaction and a stand-still condition?"

Prabhupāda: What is that? [laughter]

Pañcadraviḍa: If they stop their *karma* and take to Kṛṣṇa consciousness, everything will stand still.

Prabhupāda: Nothing stands still. We are not *karmīs.* At least, we are not doing anything. We go and become guests of Pittieji and he does everything. We do not do anything. So you try to become Kṛṣṇa conscious, everything will be done automatically. You don't have to worry. *Teṣāṁ nityābhiyuktānāṁ yoga-kṣemaṁ vahāmy aham* Bg. 9.22. Of course, you cannot stop *karma.* That is not possible. Not that everyone will become Kṛṣṇa conscious and your field of activities will be stopped. No. And Kṛṣṇa consciousness does not mean to stop the activities---some group of lazy people. No. We are the most active people, touring all over the world. Who can become a *karmī* like us? In this old age I am traveling all over the world. Can any *karmī* do that? So if you become Kṛṣṇa conscious, then *karma, jñāna, yoga,* everything becomes perfect. That is Kṛṣṇa consciousness. Just like if you get one *lakh* of rupees, ten rupees is there. You haven't got to separately to acquire ten rupees. Similarly, *karma, jñāna, yoga,* they are ten rupees, twenty rupees, fifty rupees, like that. And Kṛṣṇa consciousness is one *lakh* of rupees. As soon as you get Kṛṣṇa consciousness, you'll get everything.

Therefore Kṛṣṇa says, *sarva-dharmān parityajya mām ekaṁ śaraṇaṁ* Bg. 18.66, you'll get everything there. It is confirmed,

> akāmaḥ sarva-kāmo vā
> mokṣa-kāma udāra-dhīḥ
> tīvreṇa bhakti-yogena
> yajeta paramaṁ puruṣa

SB 2.3.10

*Akāma. Akāma* means *bhakta. Praśāntā.* He doesn't want anything. They are called *akāma. Sarvakāma* means *karmī.* He wants everything. Bring these *dānaṁ dehi, rūpaṁ dehi, yaso*[?] *dehi, dehi, dehi, dehi.* That is *karmī.* And *akāmaḥ sarva-kāmo vā mokṣa-kāma. Mokṣa-kāma* means those who are desiring after liberation. So whatever you may be, never mind. There are three classes of men = *akāma, sarva-kāma, mokṣa-kāma.* So whatever you may be, Kṛṣṇa is competent. He says, therefore, that *tīvreṇa bhakti-yogena yajeta paramaṁ puruṣa.* The only method that Kṛṣṇa says, *sarva-dharmān parityajya...* Bg. 18.66. If you, even if you want to be *karmī,* even you want the *karmī's* desire, that you want everything, to enjoy, that will also be fulfilled if you become devotee of Kṛṣṇa. *Tīvreṇa bhakti-yogena yajeta paramaṁ puruṣa.* You haven't got to work separately for fulfilling your desire of *karma* or *jñāna* or *yoga.* Everything will be there. Kṛṣṇa is so powerful. *Ye yathā māṁ prapadyante tāṁs tathaiva bhajāmy aham* Bg. 4.11. If you want from Kṛṣṇa the result of your *karma,* good result, Kṛṣṇa will give you. Kṛṣṇa is not unable to award you this.

So better you simply worship Kṛṣṇa---you get all your desires fulfilled. And the ultimate result will be that you will no more desire. Because so long you'll desire, you'll never get peace. But by worshiping Kṛṣṇa for some material motive, you'll get that. At the end you will not ask anything more. You'll be *śāntā, praśāntā.* This is the result. Just like Dhruva Mahārāja. He went to worship Kṛṣṇa for achieving greater kingdom than his father. That was his motive. But when he actually got perfection, he said, *svāmin kṛtārtho 'smi varaṁ na yāce* Cc. Madhya 22.42. *Yaṁ labdhvā cāparaṁ lābhaṁ manyate nādhikaṁ tataḥ* [Bg. 6.22]. When you get Kṛṣṇa, then you'll understand that there is no more anything more obtainable than Kṛṣṇa. Fully satisfied. That is wanted. That's all? So many? [laughter] All right. Go on.

Acyutānanda: "*Cātur-varṇyaṁ mayā ṣṛṣṭaṁ* Bg. 4.13 = is it applicable to India alone, or the whole world?"

Prabhupāda: Whole world. Kṛṣṇa, whatever Kṛṣṇa speaks, it is for the whole world. Therefore we are creating *brāhmaṇas* in the Western countries. You'll have to import *brāhmaṇa* from there. [laughter] As you are importing milk powder---all cows finished---so *brāhmaṇa* is finished. So you have to import *brāhmaṇa* from Europe and America.

Acyutānanda: "If Kṛṣṇa has created the universe, then who has created Kṛṣṇa? How did He acquire such immense powers?"

Prabhupāda: Hmm. This is foolishness. [laughter] That is explained, of course. *Janmādy asya yataḥ anvayād itarataś ca abhijñaḥ svarāṭ* SB 1.1.1; this word is used. Kṛṣṇa means *janmādy asya yataḥ.* Kṛṣṇa also explains, *ahaṁ sarvasya prabhavo mattaḥ sarvaṁ pravartate* Bg. 10.8. He is the origin of everything. But He's *svarāṭ:* there is no more origin of Kṛṣṇa. *Sarva-kāraṇa-kāraṇam* [Bs. 5.1]. That is said in the *śāstras = īśvaraḥ paramaḥ kṛṣṇaḥ sac-cid-ānanda-vigrahaḥ, anādi* [Bs. 5.1]. He has no *ādi. Anādi, ādi.* He is the *ādi,* origin of everything, but He has no *ādi.* That is God. That is God. *Anādir ādir govindaṁ sarva-kāraṇa-kāraṇam.* He is the cause of all causes. Just like I have got my father, you have got my [your] father. Your father has got father, his father, his father, his father, go on. Kṛṣṇa is the supreme father, but He has no father. That is Kṛṣṇa. Kṛṣṇa does not require any father, but he accepts a father amongst His devotees because the devotee wants Kṛṣṇa also as child. To fulfill the desire of the devotee He accepts Nanda Mahārāja as father, Vasudeva as father, just to give them pleasure, Kṛṣṇa as child. Yaśodā-mayī is enjoying the pleasure, Kṛṣṇa is playing as child. But He has no father, neither mother. He accepts the beloved devotee as father and mother. This is Kṛṣṇa.

Guest: "Is Śiva milk or *dahī?* Just now you said something about *dahī* and milk. Is Śiva milk or *dahī?*"

Prabhupāda: *Dahī.*

Guest: That is what I wanted to know.

Prabhupāda: Yes. Śiva is *dahī* and Kṛṣṇa is milk. *Dahī,* the preparation of *dahī,* that you take milk, pure milk, and mix it with little sour thing, then it becomes *dahī.* Similarly, Kṛṣṇa is pure spirit, and when this pure spirit is mixed up with *māyā,* that is Śiva. Lord Śiva is the *māyā-adhipati.* There are many, I mean to say, narrations. This was inquired by Yudhiṣṭhira Mahārāja, that "Lord Śiva, he appears to be like a beggar. He does not possess even an house. He lives underneath a tree. And the devotee of Śiva becomes very rich, opulent, materially, although he's a beggar, whereas Viṣṇu is *lakṣmī-pati, vaikuṇṭha-pati,* and the Vaiṣṇavas become beggar. Just opposite. By worshiping the beggar one becomes rich, and by worshiping the rich one becomes beggar. What is this contradiction?" So this is answered that Kṛṣṇa answered, *yasyāham anugrhṇāmi hariṣye tad-dhanaṁ śanaiḥ* SB 10.88.8 = "My first benediction to My devotee is that I take away all his riches. That's all." Then when he becomes helpless, he becomes firmly convinced, and he has no other shelter, then automatically he takes shelter of Kṛṣṇa, what Kṛṣṇa demands, *sarva-dharmān parityajya mām* Bg. 18.66. When he has no other help, he fully surrenders to Kṛṣṇa. That is Kṛṣṇa's special mercy. And so far Lord Śiva is concerned, he is the husband of mother Durgā, and Durgā is the supreme material power, *sṛṣṭi-sthiti-pralaya sādhana-śaktir ekā chāyeva yasya bhuvanāni vibharti durgā* [Bs. 5.44]. So he gets all material benediction, and Vaiṣṇava, instead of material benediction, he gets all spiritual benediction. That is the difference.

Acyutānanda: The last question = "What is the real meaning of religion?"

Prabhupāda: Religion means to abide by the laws of God. *Dharmaṁ tu sākṣād bhagavat-praṇītam* SB 6.3.19. *Dharma* is the core. Just like the state gives you law. So you cannot manufacture law at home. That is not possible. Nobody will accept that. When it is given by the state government, that is law. Similarly, what is given by God, that is religion, and that is given in the *Bhagavad-gītā.* Kṛṣṇa says, *sarva-dharmān parityajya mām ekaṁ śaraṇaṁ vraja* Bg. 18.66. This is religion. And other things cheating. That's all. *Dharmaḥ projjhita kaitavo atra* SB 1.1.2 = all cheating type of religious system is rejected. In the *Bhāga... Śrīmad-Bhāgavatam* begins, *dharmaḥ projjhita kaitavo atra.* Śrīdhara Svāmī says, "*Kaitava* means cheating." So *mokṣa vāñchā api nirasta,* even desiring for liberation, that is also cheating type of religion. Simply to surrender to Kṛṣṇa, that is religion. Otherwise no religion. *Dharmaṁ tu sākṣād bhagavat-praṇītam* SB 6.3.19. This is religion.

That's all right? Chant Hare Kṛṣṇa.

Devotees: *Jaya* Śrīla Prabhupāda. [end]