174 THE SCIENCE OF SELF-REALIZATION

So when the human beings become uninterested in religious things,
then they are animals. And how can there be happiness or peace in
animal society? They want to keep people like animals, and they are
making a United Nations. How is it possible? United animals, society for
united animals? These things are going on.

Interviewer: Do you see any hopeful signs?

Srila Prabhupada: At least they have detected that religion is declining.
That is good. ‘‘Declining’’ means they are going to be animals. In logic it
is said that man is a rational animal. When the rationality is missing, then
he is simply an animal, not a human being. In human society either you
become Christian, Muhammadan, Hindu, or Buddhist; it doesn’t matter.
There must be some system of religion. Human society without religion
is animal society. This is a plain fact. Why are people so unhappy now?
Because there is no religion. They are neglecting religion.

One gentleman has written me that Tolstoy once said, ‘‘Unless
dynamite is put underneath the church, there cannot be any peace.”
Even now the Russian government is very strictly against God con-
sciousness because they think that religion has spoiled the whole social
atmosphere.

Interviewer: It seems there could be some truth in that.

Srila Prabhupada: The religious system might have been misused, but
that does not mean that religion should be avoided. Real religion should
be taken. It does not mean that because religion has not been properly
executed by the so-called priests, religion should be rejected. If my eye is
giving me some trouble on account of a cataract, it does not mean that
the eye should be plucked out. The cataract should be removed. That is
Krsna consciousness.

Interviewer: I think history shows that many people have misused
religion. Isn’t that a fact?

Srila Prabhupada: These people have no conception of God, and they
are preaching religion. What is religion? Dharmam tu saksad bhagavat-
pranitam: ‘‘The path of religion is directly enunciated by the Supreme
Lord.”’ They have no conception of God—they do not know what God
is—and they are professing some religion. How long can it go on ar-
tificially? It will deteriorate.

That has become the present condition. They have no idea of God, so
how will they know what is the order of God? Religion means the order
of God. For example, law means the order of the state. If there is no
state, then where is the order? We have a clear conception of God—
Krsna. He is giving His order, and we accept it. It is clear religion. If there
